Ian Bergman:

Well, good morning, afternoon and evening, everyone. You know, today, I couldn't be happier to welcome Alexander Kravchenko to the show. Alex is Deputy Product Officer at EOS Data Analytics, an incredible geospatial data startup that was a recent participant in the AWS Space Accelerator powered by AlchemistX. Alex's product experience stretches back several years and several startups and builds on a prior career in journalism and politics. And we'll talk about some of that. Innovation and the concept of driving change has been consistent and important throughout Alex's career, and I can't wait to hear some of his lessons and stories. Alex, it's great to have you on the show.

Aleksandr Kravchenko:

Hello, Ian. Hi to all the listeners here. It's an honor to be here, and I hope my story and experience will be of interest, helpful and insightful.

Ian Bergman:

I'm certain it will. Can you start by telling us a little bit about your personal story? I noted that you spent some significant time in journalism before pivoting to product. So how did your journey lead you to where you are today?

Aleksandr Kravchenko:

Yeah, sure. Looking back, I recognized that my path was quite specific due to being uncommon compared to some guys who appeared in IT Within an essential path through learning computer science management early joining some IT company as a trainee, etc. That's not my case. So I started my path in journalism, as you've mentioned, Ian, and I was a political observer. By the way, I've got a master's degree in political science, Ian, then a commissioning editor, and finally, I became editor-in-chief at one of the most trusted news agencies in Ukraine. I rebuilt the operations there, the news release approach, rethought the monetization model and launched educational programs to improve the skills of my colleagues. 

It all started working significantly better, even within the limited resources, and I had no idea at that moment that what I was doing is related to some sort of corporate innovation. But at some point, I felt I was getting bored because everything was fine. And I came up to the stage when, you know, some people say, "Don't go where everything is fine. Go to the company where there is a space for big improvements." It was a trigger to try something new outside the journalist's world. So I decided to break the established career beliefs and disrupt the steps of my chosen industry, which was growing rapidly at that moment, especially in our country.

I had no experience in IT but had a good managerial background and extremely high motivation multiplied by insane ambitions. So I've been hired as a copywriter in a company specializing in business events and trade shows worldwide, especially in China. In three months, I started working as a product manager, then as a project manager. Then I took two more projects to lead within a group of companies. And by the way, there I had my first experience of participating in the accelerator program. Our company, Expert Promoter, was selected to participate in China Accelerator, and that was an interesting and insightful journey. So I would say that the reason for my successful immersion or pivoting in product management and digital business, in general, is striving to move forward, to learn, and the willingness to innovate wherever I am. So, as a result of relaunching the marketplace for trade shows in China in terms of business model, giving more revenue, launching a startup and matchmaking app for events worldwide, and finally releasing to Within the Startup the platform for online events. Similar to helping… you've probably heard of those guys with lots of communication, matchmaking, and promotion features.

And then I started questioning myself again. “Is that it? Is that all you can do, man?” And this was another trigger pushing me out for opportunities. And so more than two years ago, I joined a great company of professionals keen on remote sensing, and the space industry, EOS Data Analytics. So diving deeper and deeper into product development methodologies, business operations, people management, etc., I realized that there is a vast space for corporate innovation. And I started to help build the company and set out here. I obtained an opportunity to participate in the AWS Space Accelerator, enabling me in my company to immerse in vast prospects of collaboration and business development. 

I was thrilled with such an opportunity when I saw a message in the Slack thread that we'd been selected for the AWS accelerator, and my first thought was “This could be, and we need to brainstorm shortly, collect the ideas, build a plan on how can we improve. What can we improve? How can we highlight our collaboration points with AWS and the AlchemistX?” And then the story began.

Ian Bergman:

That's so cool. So there are a couple of points I want to dive into, and we're going to come back to the accelerator experience. But I don't know if you know that you and I share something: I also started with a really early career in journalism and political journalism, and I thought that that would be a career. But it turned out I wasn't as good at it as you. But there's something interesting, I think. Right? Journalists have to observe, and they have to sense the challenges, the problems, and the trends that are going on in society. Is that a skill you feel has helped you on your path into corporate innovation and technology? Yeah.

Aleksandr Kravchenko:

Sure. Journalism... the key component of journalism is, as you've said, observing and diving deep and a willingness to get to the truth and having a lot of doubts, and exploring some new prospects which make interest in which seem to be profitable. I would say.

Ian Bergman:

There's something about relentless curiosity that I think really pays off. And so this path led you to your role at EOS Data Analytics. Can you just tell us a bit more about what you are working on right now?

Aleksandr Kravchenko:

Currently, as you have mentioned, I am a deputy CPO and the product manager at the same time at EOS D. So I'm involved in many streams, including our flagship product, crop monitoring, and top-notch precision farming tool. Here I lead one of the product streams, and I'm also responsible for the white label stream, product operations and some scale-up initiatives, and involved in company-wide strategic streams, helping us to grow rapidly to move in the proper direction. And one of those is building tight collaboration with AWS coming out of the AWS Accelerator. Feel free to ask something specific if it’s of interest to you because there are too many activities I'm involved in. So if we focus on all of them, it would take not just a couple of hours.

Ian Bergman:

Yeah, we need to let you get to sleep at some point here, but let's just dive in a little bit on the mission of EOS Data Analytics. So so, two questions, I think one, your website right now has a countdown on it. What's it counting down to? And then also just tell us a little bit more, like what does EOS Data Analytics do? What is Earth sensing and analytics?

Aleksandr Kravchenko:

The countdown actually shows the days remaining to launch our first satellite US set like US set one. So that means that it allows us to cover both downstream and upstream solutions we have. So many companies own their satellites, and they start by just launching satellites and selling some satellite data we have, but they don't have their downstream product as we have now. Like, for instance, its US proprietary platform. We have been moving in a bit another way, understanding the needs of the end users. Covering as many use cases as we can. And then we realized that launching our own satellite would be game-changing, I would say. So. EOS DA, in terms of people, in terms of operations, is a group of game changers led by our chief advisor. And the thing is that we all have space, and it doesn't mean we have time to look differently and reflect in order to rethink our solutions or approaches. For instance, we recently had a couple of spinoff ideas with big research and selected one to test out. But in the end, we realized that our assumptions didn't match real user demand. It's one of the attempts at learning, which we also use as an approach to get insights, but at the same time, at some point realized that we've got a great downstream solution and proprietary platform providing our users with a set of tools for precision farming. But in terms of the future, we are limited by the data provided by other satellites. So we decided to launch our own satellite constellation, and the first satellite, Set One is going to orbit soon. You've seen the countdown. Later this year. So it is innovative in terms of full precision egg and not only agriculture, it covers the full cycle from upstream and downstream, as I've said, and nobody else does this right now.

Ian Bergman:

It's amazing. And can we just talk about how delighted my inner nerd is to have a conversation where somebody says, “So we decided to launch our own satellite constellation”? 

Aleksandr Kravchenko:

I will try to look a bit different than that. I recently heard a joke from one of our developers, like we were just discussing the things coming up in our company and our achievements and one of our developers said something like, "When we launch our own satellite." And one of the recruiters writes me on LinkedIn offering a new job. I will ask them, “Does your company have a satellite?” “No.” “Then go find someone else.” And he actually said bad words. And the answer, But I won't. But the key point I mean, the key point lies in this examplel, I would say.

Ian Bergman:

That's the main amazing. So, as you mentioned, we got introduced through the US Space Accelerator program. And so, how does a program like that help EOS Data advance your mission?

Aleksandr Kravchenko:

As I've highlighted in one of our press releases devoted to our participation in the AWS Space Accelerator program, we graduated with a vision of expanded prospects for a rapid business boost. So the accelerator is a significant milestone for EOS DA in strengthening cooperation, where AWS is establishing contacts with top customers and partners and implementing new ideas to our product solutions. So as I've said, I really feel like it's as if you realize that you can now fly outside your solar system. 

And we now keep working within the decent roadmap of our collaboration with AWS. I believe that in the short term, we will definitely get significant results for both parties and not only the short term but long-term cooperation as well. And we have a chance now to get in touch with new partners. We're doing more promotion. We are getting consultancy on our various needs, like how to improve our artificial intelligence and machine-learning solutions, optimize our storage, how to better improve and market our crop monitoring, white label solutions, how to level up our DevOps team via some training, and certifications, and more. So it looks like a qualitatively new stage of our unstoppable growth, I would say.

Ian Bergman:

That whole idea I love, I love the metaphor of, you know, moving outside of your own solar system and expanding the orbit. It works well, but that whole idea of innovation being fueled by connections between different parties that all play a part, I think, is really powerful. So I'm glad you saw some of that. 

So let's talk a little bit more about your story. And there is one huge elephant in the room here. So you're based in Kyiv? You know, there is there's the tragedy of the war that is looming over the country. And I'm sure your work. Can you share a little bit about how that's impacting you, your friends and family, and the team you work with?

Aleksandr Kravchenko:

Yeah, that's a good question about tough reality. I was actually foreseeing the war coming up, but not that large scale as it is now as it began. So when it all started on February 24th, we inevitably faced an operational drawdown due to everybody having to save and secure their beloved ones. And but in like two, four weeks when each of our guys, and me with my family as well. Found a shelter in the village or in another city in another part of Ukraine. We started reviving our operations. We revised our plans and normalized our work as much as possible. 

So the main challenge, and it still remains, was keeping a war-life balance, keeping living ,now fighting stress. Keep planning your life and grow your productivity. But all this actually looks more like tourism compared to what our guys from the armed forces experience being injured. And what is horrible is to realize too many of our brave warriors are not with us anymore. So how did it go when EOS DA was in the AWS Space Accelerator at that moment during the active phases? At some events, there were air strikes and alarms, but you didn't hear that because I was muted. But we are kinda tempered, I would say, and I was more concerned with the time difference when we worked for 15 hours a day in June rather than with these attacks and alarms which were nearby. 

So speaking about the current status of the business, we now have complete operational capabilities. And at some point, it's important, I think, to highlight that we really realized that what helped us achieve what we have now within the current conditions in the country, we found out that it's flexibility and leadership. And it seems to me that those are applicable as the crisis management drivers to keep any company afloat.

Ian Bergman:

That's some really, really interesting thoughts there. And it seems that you know, balancing the realities of the world around you with the motivation, to keep moving forward… It was tough. And so how important was it across you and your leadership team to help the team balance, as you say, war, life, or work balance? And how did you do that?

Aleksandr Kravchenko:

It was extremely important to have myself as one of the leaders and to have all other leaders consolidated around solving potential – not like potential. There were risks that occurred. So to focus on making collecting everybody over like safety. So the key main goal was not the business, as somebody might think, but about the safety and security of all the guys who were and are working within the company. So safety in terms of both physical and mental safety. And we have launched a lot of initiatives with some psychological training devoted to different stabilization mechanics and methodologies. It was a challenge, and it remains a challenge because the situation is unstable. And sometimes I'm not... I wouldn't say that we lose motivation. We more lose productivity, and it influences a lot and then influences leaders as well. But anyways, we are brave as well, even if we are civilians. So we are fighting too.

Ian Bergman:

Well, thank you for sharing that. You know, when the world is changing around you so rapidly and in such unpredictable ways, but also tragic ways, it's hard to imagine how you would adapt at the moment. And it's inspiring to see what is happening and what you and your team and families have been able to do, you know?

If I look a little bit deeper into your past and we look across your career, everything that sort of helped you get to where you are today. Is there something that you are most proud of? Is there a moment in your career that you're just incredibly proud of, that maybe you want to share with our listeners?

Aleksandr Kravchenko:

The most significant fact I would say I'm proud of is that I was doing corporate innovation, not realizing that I was doing corporate innovation. So this is the. So speaking frankly, I'm proud that my professional path is essentially threaded with innovations. And when I realized, for instance, that we are facing rapid growth of our competitors, I came to the CEO of the news agency, when I was a journalist, with a pack of dogs, with the schemes, strategies, and organizational structure changes and pitched him for 30 minutes, finalizing with the words like, “It is time to change the company and the game. Do it now, or somebody else will.” And. Another example, like when the COVID-19 pandemic happened, we've been thinking in the company of sea levels, “What shall we do,” and evaluated “What can we do?” So it was even business, and it won't survive anyways offline at that moment. So at that point, I stated that either we focus on what we can do and the company dies in three months, or we pursue our investor that we need to invest more to be the first to roll out a platform for online events and not only survive, but match with the future trends of switching the event business to online.

So from that point of sight, we knew that our chances to disrupt our target markets were 50/50, but we rolled out and succeeded, already having the total volume of contracts signed for $1 million at the third month of development. So I know that such a case also covers crisis management. But I will say that corporate innovation somehow consists and, at some points, means risks, proper forecasting, and space for an out-of-the-box solution. And as I've highlighted previously, speaking about EOS DA I am extremely proud to work with those essential game changers. So, yeah, we have already built a wonderful downstream platform. We are aiming to launch our EOS SAT Constellation with seven satellites by 2025. And it is really great when there is an opportunity to tell some recruiter that if you don't have a satellite, I won't work with you.

Ian Bergman:

It's a thought and a sentiment that is going to stick with me for sure. So let's go in the other direction. You know, everybody has stories as well of something that, in hindsight, they would do differently. So is there anything, as you look back across your career, and particularly in the world of innovation, corporate innovation, where if you had a do-over, you would have done something differently?

Aleksandr Kravchenko:

I think I would allocate more time to studying anthropology and psychology in order to understand people inside out. I deem such knowledge valuable. According to the experience I already gained knowing people, their behavior, whom to negotiate with and with whom not, how to pursue in a lean way and etc. So what I'm saying is that if I obtained this knowledge earlier and ensure that it becomes a basis for my further learnings, it would result in much better decisions I made in my professional path in general. And I'd like to address this point to the people listening to this podcast: learn more about people and their behavior. Because everything revolves around people, unless we get replaced by robots.

Ian Bergman:

Yeah. And, even if we do, at least the first generation will have presumably been built by people. I think that's such an important point, and it's something that is so easy to forget. Right? And as we're head-down in our day-to-day that human motivations and emotions are complex. So the study of people, I love it. 

Do you have any favorite reading or anything that you've you've looked at recently that speaks to people?

Aleksandr Kravchenko:

I have recently read once more the book by Tom DeMarco, "Deadline". Because lots of points coming out from there get threaded through my professional career in the companies I have worked in. And the book I am reading now, I've started it's partially about people, about psychology and people. It's Rory Sutherland, “Alchemy”. And quite an interesting one in terms of non-standard thinking and some deep diving into the psychology of specifics of human brain thinking, non-standard standard thinking, etc.

Ian Bergman:

Very cool. Well, we'll get that in the show notes. I'm going to add that to my reading list because I haven't read it, and it sounds like the sort of thing to take in small, intense chunks and then let my brain relax for a while. 

You're doing a lot, and you've been doing a lot. One of the questions that we always ask because I think it's incredibly important in these times, how do you avoid burnout, and how do you help the team around you avoid burnout and take care of themselves while remaining productive?

Aleksandr Kravchenko:

Well, many people get deeply stressed when they realize that they are burning out and don't know how to fix this issue. It's like a corporate curse of the 21st century, but burnout is just a problem amongst others. Each problem has its root cause, and find what caused the problem and eliminate it or build a plan to get rid of it. So personally, I experienced burnout, and I didn't like that, actually. So several recommendations I would give to our listeners, which helped me to normalize my inner status... I'm often asking my teammates if everything is okay and I try to look to them to dive deep into their brains and understand if it's all okay. Not saying about burnout, just “Are you overdosed or are you happy?” or something like that. And speaking to colleagues, when you ask about keeping colleagues away from burnout, I would say that regular communication, regularly taking care [are key]. I know, as a father of the guys we are working with is of crucial importance to avoid this one. So when it comes to some general advice that comes out partially from my experience, I would say the first one is no multitasking.

Do not start a new task before you finish the one you are working on now. Learn to say no. Keeping in mind that your time is limited and prioritized. It helps us a lot to remain in a safe space. Ask for feedback from the stakeholders; everybody essentially needs feedback to make sure that your efforts are worth this. 

Have a healthy sleep. It's a must to sustain your body and free your mind from unneeded information. Switch your focus to something absolutely opposite. Go drive a car. When you feel that you're stuck on some task, go for a walk on the route that you haven't walked before or try doing something differently. What I'm saying is each of us does common routine actions each day. Let's say you are going around the house, moving from one room to another to take your phone charger. Yeah. Have you ever tried walking backward in your house? No. Why not? So it's ridiculous, isn't it? It's absolutely ridiculous. But the idea is to let some kind of bug into your daily routine, and it will help you get yourself fixed a bit. So it's not a bucket. It's a feature.

Ian Bergman:

Amazing. So we talk about managing the balance of work and life and staying productive, and avoiding burnout, which is a great lead into some questions about working in and around startups. Right? So they can be, they can be pretty challenging, a lot of fun. But what advice or encouragement would you give to anyone who is thinking of founding or working at a startup themselves?

Aleksandr Kravchenko:

Well, I would say that founding a startup and working there is a two-sided story. So being hired in the startup is an amazing opportunity to get a vast set of skills improved rapidly and know the business essence inside out. But here, you need to know that when you gain something, you sacrifice something. It will take your time and forces, and at some point, you might feel you are burning out. But again, it's worth it because none of the non-startup companies would give you that drive and knowledge you get in a startup. A startup is a business built from scratch with less stability and with higher risks, but ensuring you get an opportunity to be involved in all parts of it. So the problem is the corporate environment. It happens that ideas that diverge from the company's existing business model may hit a wall, so they don't fit into the time frame of quarterly goals, or they seem too risky. There is no designated staff or budget to foster them, and so forth. A startup is a group of people united by an idea, not just striving to follow the rules and grow and get paid a salary. This is actually where unicorns are born. From the founder's perspective (I haven't actually been a founder, but I know many founders and the challenges they face), a startup is a journey letting you get as much experience as possible through fails in a good meeting like first attempts learning. Insignificant achievement. It is a sort of lifestyle. When you believe in what you do, and you live your product. Startups, by nature, are driven by philosophy experimentation. So founders have already put their savings and houses and mortgages to do what they believe in, and they are not scared of making mistakes. So when they come into a corporate environment, they are willing to ask tough questions, identify operational inefficiencies, and identify opportunities at the same time.

Ian Bergman:

Oh, that's great. And, you know, this notion of being united by an idea is going to stick with me. Right? Because I think it captures the essence of a high-functioning startup team that'll totally stick with me. 

Well, so let's look forward a little bit now: As you think about what's next for you personally and for the industry, like what is the future look like for you?

Aleksandr Kravchenko:

I'm actually the guy who combines two in one. I'm a practitioner and a dreamer at the same time. So within such a combo, I assume we'll get something similar to one of the Black Mirror series in a good way, I hope.

Ian Bergman:

That's a really important caveat when you're saying we're going to get something like Black Mirror.

Aleksandr Kravchenko:

Yeah. So when people had limited, unlimited access to their memories on the go. So it seems to me that in the future, people will have access to any information and data using their brains only. And in my opinion, it will be as common as using a smartphone. And this could actually be a good B2C idea for AWS. It will help us in terms of charging for data storage and transfer.

Ian Bergman:

The brain cloud connection. I'm sure someone over there is working on it probably.

Aleksandr Kravchenko:

Yeah. But from a practical point of view, I would say that we will inevitably face the current space race transforming to a set of sustainable and maybe even joint solutions, serving specific goals in terms of waste, reducing cost optimizations, deviations, detection, and much more in various industries like agriculture, carbon emissions, forestry, oil and gas, mining, etc. And EOS DA is going to be there in that future, enhanced by its strategic partners amongst which is AWS.

Ian Bergman:

Amazing. And so, as you and the team at EOS DA move forward, what's the best way for our listeners to connect with or follow your work?

Aleksandr Kravchenko:

LinkedIn works, and actually, I'm not doing blogs or workshops. The best way, I think, is to follow us on LinkedIn and other social platforms and also attend our webinars. We conduct them pretty often, dedicated to different topics. And gathering like industry professionals only. But if any questions arise, everybody, both you, Ian, and your listeners, can write to me directly via LinkedIn and also follow AlchemistX. I forgot to say that.

Ian Bergman:

There you go. I appreciate that little plug, and I'll be reaching out on LinkedIn and probably email and maybe phone when I see something that's really incredible. Before we wrap up here, what else should I have asked you? There's so much going on in your world. Any other topics that you really want to cover right now?

Aleksandr Kravchenko:

It seems to me that we have covered a lot of points that might be of interest to our listeners, but if somebody wants to ask something else, get in touch, get in partnership and etc., feel free to reach out via LinkedIn or wherever you can find me.

Ian Bergman:

That sounds great. You know, innovation and addressing the challenges around us. It's a challenge for us all, and it's something I think we all struggle with. But many of our listeners really live and breathe it every day. And so, to that end, Alex, thank you so much for your time. Really enjoyed this conversation. It was wide-ranging and super interesting, and a few nuggets that are really going to stick with me. And I just want to say thank you for coming on the show, and I hope you have a wonderful evening and stay safe and productive going forward.

Aleksandr Kravchenko:

Awesome. Many thanks to our listeners. Special thanks to you, Ian, for having me here.